New EU members

[Lass]

So today, Romania and Bulgaria officially became members of the European Union, as I guess you'll all know. Personally, I think that enlargement can only put some (if not, a lot) financial/economic strain on the EU/the other states. I guess we richer nations will have to support them, indirectly. And then we'll have to look after the extra immigrants ... Not the best news ever for the UK, IMHO (OK, I confess, I'm not a big fan of the EU). But a big step forward for Romania and Bulgaria.

Still, how far can enlargement go?

There are also fears that the countries' economies will fail to compete with the rest of the EU's once trade barriers come down.

Immigration fears

Both Bulgaria and Romania are much poorer than the rest of the EU, with GDP per capita of about 33% of the EU average, compared with 50% in Poland.

Some Western European member states fear a flood of new immigrants, but officials in both countries say most of those who wanted to work abroad have already left.
[ Taken from http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/6220591.stm ]

[appleton]

As far as I know immigrants are being limited from these countries.

Personally, I think that enlargement can only put some (if not, a lot) financial/economic strain on the EU/the other states.

It shouldn't as long as the balance is put straight. The poorer countries pay as much as they can pay towards it etc. I know the Netherlands has been a big loser because it's spent more then any other EU country so far.

Still, how far can enlargement go?

The whole of Europe? Whether Turkey is part of Europe though is another question and will vary from person to person.

Not the best news ever for the UK, IMHO (OK, I confess, I'm not a big fan of the EU). But a big step forward for Romania and Bulgaria.

I can't see how this will effect the UK. We have limited the number of immigrants allowed in (after the polish invasion ).

Matt

[DodgeFB]

I really don't think I would want to be in something like the EU. I am very loyal to the US. And I would feel like we were selling out our country (constitution, Flag, and traditions.)

But then I really don't know that much about it.

[Lad]

As from today hundreds of thousands of immigrants from Bulgaria and Romania will head to the Uk. Why? Becaue they know our state benefits are the best to be had. Not a financial burden or the UK or "bad news for the UK" Matt?

Figures as at August this year.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/5273356.stm

Figures predicted for 2007. You bet - they will be much, much higher. This is because this is the legal amount! Not the illegal amount.

Predictions on how many will come to Britain vary from 56,000 to 180,000 in the first year.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/6221979.stm

[Luke]

From this side of the pond, the EU looks like a bumbling, inefficient political monstrosity. Ok, ok, strong words. I'm not really supportive of it, though, as it seems to undermine nations' individual rights and attempt to mold all of Europe together, which would be an impossible alliance to manage properly for very long IMO.

[Lad]

That's a perfect summary Luke. It is very inefficient in many areas and the majority of europeans do not want it. Member states have very limited sovereignty and this is decreasing every year. Europe has always been enemies and while it is great we are all now friends we are separate countries for a reason. I can see the EU either caving in on itself on its own success or breaking down because of war.

[Lass]

[quote=Luke]
From this side of the pond, the EU looks like a bumbling, inefficient political monstrosity. Ok, ok, strong words. I'm not really supportive of it, though, as it seems to undermine nations' individual rights and attempt to mold all of Europe together, which would be an impossible alliance to manage properly for very long IMO.
[/quote]

Love your description of the EU, Luke! 'Inefficient political...' reminded me of one of the better known problems with the EU, the massive democratic deficit, as they call it. It results in people not taking elections to the European Parliament seriously. In 2004, only 38.2% of people in the UK voted. I imagine that is because people don't understand how the EU works, and so don't care for their vote, or because they do understand, and realise just how useless their representatives in the European Parliament are.

[appleton]

A lot has gone on since I last posted in this thread. However I have a few words to say on this matter now.

We will see who's right and who's wrong in the future

[DodgeFB]

Just so I can keep up. Are we dealing with a global view and a protectionist view?

I am an old conservative. And I am not liking much about this "New World Order" thing going on.

[Luke]

I'm a young conservative and don't like it either.